Redesign systems to address complex challenges / Penny Hagen / Episode #106
As a customer you've probably already experienced that most services don't fail because of bad intentions. Often services fail because they run on top of systems that don't support a different outcome. The classics "The computer says..." statement is just one of the many example. This isn't just a major frustration for us as ordinary customers but also for us as professionals trying to make things better. Let me ask you a question: How often have you been in a project where you had the mandate and budget to address these deeper systemic issues To my experience this almost never happens. So we keep working on projects with a limited scope that only have a chance of delivering a temporary fix at best. If you really want to address the bigger challenges in our organisations (and society) you have to shift your thinking from programs and projects to a more systemic mindset. You need to work on changing the underlaying and supporting structures. Which is by no means is an easy thing to do. Someone who has been pioneering this field for the last decade is [Penny Hagen](https://go.servicedesignshow.com/grl7m). In this weeks episode Penny shares the lessons she learned around: How to budget for systemic change? How to measure progress? And how to keep people motivated when they don't see tangible change right away? I feel that this episode is especially valuable if your work currently has narrow scope and you feel like you're not getting the opportunity to address the root causes of challenges. After listening the conversation with Penny you'll definitely have some ideas about how you can start making impact on a more fundamental level through your work. --- [ GUIDE ] -— 00:00 Welcome to episode 106 02:45 Who is Penny 04:20 60 second question round 06:40 Adopting a more systemic and holistic view 12:50 Are we brave enough? 14:20 What we track is what we value 17:30 Helping people to see the value of our work 26:00 Showing results on different levels 30:45 We have to look inward for solutions 38:10 Don't keep it open 43:05 Did you make change 44:20 Nothing is out of scope 47:50 Scaling isn't about the what 50:20 Ways of working for complex challenges 52:50 Get in touch with Penny 53:35 Final thoughts --- [ LINKS ] --- * [twitter.com/pennyhagen](http://twitter.com/pennyhagen) * [https://twitter.com/codesignlab_akl](https://twitter.com/codesignlab_akl) * [linkedin.com/in/pennyhagen/](https://www.linkedin.com/in/pennyhagen/) --- [ MORE ] --- Enjoyed the show? Take a look at some of the other episodes. [go.servicedesignshow.com/spotify](http://go.servicedesignshow.com/spotify) YOUTUBE Every episode of the Service Design Show is also available as via the official YouTube channel. [go.servicedesignshow.com/youtube](http://go.servicedesignshow.com/youtube) INSTAGRAM Get an exclusive behind the scenes look of the Show. [go.servicedesignshow.com/instagram](http://go.servicedesignshow.com/instagram) --- [ FREE COURSE ] --- HOW TO EXPLAIN SERVICE DESIGN Learn what it takes to get your clients, colleagues, managers, CEOs and even grandmas as excited about service design as you are! [servicedesignshow.com/free-course](http://servicedesignshow.com/free-course)